Officer Involved: Alivia Schwab - Police Law Newsletter
This is a case where even the most aggressive anti-police activists would have a difficult time criticizing the decision that the officer made as he pulled the trigger and utilized deadly force.
Also, this is a case where (under the review of an objective lens) there was very simple path to avoid the use of deadly force.
The fault does not lie with the officer who utilized deadly force - but the other officer on scene who’s obvious missteps were a major contributing cause to an Officer-Involved-Shooting (OIS).
This incident occurred on Sept 28, 2023 in Morris, Illinois (which is a small town approximately an hour southwest of Chicago) and it involved a woman named Alivia Schwab (40).
Ms. Schwab had been suffering with bipolar disorder and schizophrenia and had been living in a residential treatment facility. She had just been released from a mental health facility and was living in an apartment trying to get her life back together.
This incident began when Ms. Schwab’s mental health providers called 911 and reported that she had threatened to kill herself with a knife.
This prompted the operator to dispatch officers from the Morris, Illinois police department.
Two officers with the Morris Police Department arrived on scene (Nick Pampinella and Casie Price).
The officers arrived, exited their cars, and started walking towards the apartment of Ms. Schwab.
As officers approached the apartment, Ms. Schwab emerged from her apartment and stood near the front door. At this point she was armed with a 9” knife in her left hand and had a cell phone in her right hand that was up to her ear.
Officer Pampinella stated to Officer Price "you go non-lethal”. Officer Price then looked at Officer Pampinella and acknowledged this plan/force array.
Ms. Schwab then (without saying a word) started to walk towards Officer Pampinella and he gave the following commands,
"Hi, miss. Miss, drop the knife, drop the knife." "Drop, stop coming towards me! Stop coming towards me!"
As the knife-wielding woman was bearing down on Officer Pampinella (who was quickly walking backwards) - Officer Price just stood there - off to the side - doing nothing. Officer Price’s hands were empty. She did not even have the Taser drawn.
An obviously frustrated Officer Pampinella then yelled, “Casie! Tase her!” (to Officer Price).
It was at that point that Officer Price snapped back to planet earth and started fumbling while trying to unholster and turn on the Taser - as well as trying to catch up to where Ms. Schwab was.
Officer Pampinella then yelled, “Stop” and “Stop! Or you are going to get shot!”.
Ms. Schwab then started to run towards officer Pampinella. She took approximately three to four “running strides” and got within 8-10 feet of Officer Pampinella.
It was at that point that he utilized deadly force and fired three rounds at Ms. Schwab. Ms. Schwab sustained fatal injuries.
(body cam)
There has been some criticism and question as to why police officers were dispatched to this call and not mental health professionals.
First, any issue, criticism, or problem that you have with who is dispatched to a call for service lies with the politicians who manage police departments - not the men and women who suit up and respond to the calls they are sent.
There are police departments that have “mobile crisis teams”. These teams are typically made up of an officer (who has CIT or ECIT training) and a mental health clinician. I am a fan of this model.
But. Even in agencies that have these “mobile crisis teams” - the mental health clinicians are not in play until the call is deemed “safe”. A situation where someone was still armed with a knife would always dictate that armed police officers respond first and then call the mental health professionals once the individual is in custody and the knife is secured.
I do not know where the breakdown occurred here, but the police managers in Morris better figure it out.
Officer Pampinella told Officer Price to go “non lethal”. If she did not know what to do - her partner gave her the answer. All she had to do was follow directions.
Once Officer Price made the decision to finally draw the Taser - she had difficulty unholstering the weapon and turning it on.
If she had this much trouble with basic manipulations - my guess - if she had deployed the Taser - it would have missed Ms. Schwab.
Ms. Schwab was advancing on Officer Pampinella (who was backing up) while armed with a 9” knife. If anything Officer Pampinella likely let her get too close before firing his weapon.
This is obviously an objectively reasonable and lawful use of deadly force.
The Grundy County District Attorney has also stated that the use of deadly force was within the law.
A plaintiff’s attorney (working behalf of the Schwab) family said that the officers were in no danger because the knife was “pointed downward in a nonthreatening manner”.
It is impossible for a 9” knife to be held in “non-threatening manner” when you are chasing someone with it.
This is an easy statement to make from the safety of a law office. Only those that hold the dishonest privilege of viewing everything through 20/20 hindsight make such idiotic comments.
Think about this.
There was a point in this incident where Ms. Schwab was advancing on Officer Pampinella with a 9 inch knife. And Officer Price stood back, watched, and allowed this to happen without drawing her Taser or firearm.
This is unacceptable.
ncG1vNJzZmion6G2pLHLmq6nnaeoe7TBwayrmpubY7CwuY6pZqielp6wpr6MoqWvp5yrsqV5wKWgr6GRYsCktNaamQ%3D%3D